Vacations of yesteryear

by Kim

Beginning in the 1970s, Holiday Inn was looking to reinvent their hotels and further cater to traveling families and business clientele

The adult amusement park of yesterday, the Holiday Inn Holidome

This made me think of childhood vacations.  What are your memories, good and bad?  Is there a modern equivalent of the Holidome?

133 thoughts on “Vacations of yesteryear

  1. When I was a kid, I loved the Holidome! I would go through the Holiday Inn book and try to steer my parents to only book vacations in the locations that had Holidomes. I haven’t thought about them for years.

  2. OMG, the Holidomes! One summer (I think it was 1977 or 1978), we went to California for a couple of weeks. We flew in to San Francisco, then rented a care and meandered our way down to LA. We stayed at a few Holiday Inns along the way. This was unusual for us, as we generally just visited relatives during the summer. Anyway, I know we made a lot of visits to places of historical and cultural significance, but I don’t remember much about those visits. By far the #1 thing I remember from that trip were the Holidomes and how much fun they were. The indoor pools! The pinball machines!! My brother and I had the best time there.

  3. Growing up truly middle class, we didn’t have money for vacations until I was in middle school. The first one we took was a complete failure. As an only child it our family was my parents, my paternal grandmother and me. No one had similar interests it didn’t go well, and it didn’t happen again. When my dad started working overseas and I was in college is when vacations actually began. But, growing up in our area very few people did the vacations of today. It was mostly traveling to see family or a day trip to the beach. My vacations were visiting my aunt a week a year in the summer and, for a few years after we moved, returning to spend about 5 days with a friend and then her coming to spend 5 days with us.

    As a college student and adult I traveled more. We have taken a few big (either long or more expensive) family vacations. Disney World when the girls were the right age to enjoy it the first time was great. A trip to the coast (4 hours for us) for 4 days one Thanksgiving and a Christmas cruise a few years ago were both relaxing to be away. I had originally hoped we would be on a Christmas cruise this year as it is a good way to unplug from technology and do things we wouldn’t always do. The girls like cruises because they are a good balance of fun excursions along with days at sea that you can find things to do on board or sleep or generally chill.

    My bucket list for things to do when travel opens up widely again is growing…

  4. I remember when I was about 9, there was a family wedding in MA and so we went to it and stayed in a hotel where there was an indoor pool with PLANTS all around – I think to give it a ‘grotto’ feel – and IIRC there was some kind of waterfall/water feature. It was bliss. 9yo me would never have gotten out of the pool!!!

    Denver, we have had our nanny take the kids to Great Wolf Lodge every year (not this year) for a while – it’s a twofer, building childhood memories for the kids, plus DH and I get date night!

  5. I’d never heard of the Holidome before today. We didn’t take many vacations growing up – three I think. Once to Hawaii when I was eight. My mom’s favorite cousin’s husband was in the Navy and was serving there at the time so we went to see them for a couple days and then spent a week in Maui.

    And then we went to Disneyland twice. Both are bittersweet memories. The first time we went was when my sister didn’t have much longer to live (she died of cancer when we were kids). In the picutres, you can see most of her hair had fallen out from the chemo.

    And the second time was when my parents had just gotten divorced. My mom took us on her own. My mom’s favorite ride was the Matterhorn. And both times we went, it was the first ride we went on. I never told her that I had nightmares after riding it on that first trip. So on our second trip (I was a senior in high school and my youngest brother was 7), we all went to ride the Matterhorn. And my brother was terrified and yelled “F*** You” at the top of his lungs to my mom during the ride. You couldn’t get mad at him for doing so. I probably could have saved my brother that experience if it had occurred to me to tell my mom that the ride had given me nightmares. It has become a family story that we laugh about now.

    I’m realizing this is a bit of a downer. Sorry about that. We have had good vacations with our kids. Although I did repeat my mom’s mistake and DH and I took DD on the Tower of Terror when she was 5 at Disneyworld. We’d gradually led up to this – started on the little kid rides, moved on to more adventurous roller coasters. Those were all fine. She loved speed. It was the dark that scared her. Later, we tried to get her to go on the ride at Epcot where you travel through history and she wanted nothing to do with it because it was in the dark.

  6. And we’ve taken our kids to Great Wolf Lodge a couple times. I am grateful they have grown out of that experience – the noise was total sensory overload for me.

  7. I had to Google Gaylord because I had not heard of them, and now I want to go to one! Indoor snow tubing? OTOH, it could be a sensory overload nightmare!

  8. I loved Holidomes! My parents wouldn’t stay in them (they preferred Days Inn), but I got a few Holidomes on middle school trips. So much fun, especially with 50 of your classmates! I actually last stayed a Holidome about 10 years ago in Fargo. Work trip, and I didn’t pick the hotel, and I didn’t use the pool, but it was active with families.

    When I was in elementary school, before I knew what Holidomes were, we would take an annual winter weekend trip to a hotel in Canada. It was Canada’s version of the Holidome, it was AH-MAZ-ING. Indoor pools, outdoor pools, waterslides, hot tubs, indoor mini golf, bowling, arcade! We’d go with 5-10 other families. The dads would play poker in the hallways, the moms would hang out in the cafe, and the kids just ran around in heaven. So many happy memories from those annual trips.

  9. SSM – My most vivid Disneyland memories include the Matterhorn (so scary), the house of the future (Jetsons), and the Swiss Family Robinson house (I was obsessed with the movie). Later we took our kids to WDW and I was very disappointed with the Swiss Family Robinson tree house. Not at all as I remembered.

  10. SSM, when my son was 7 or 8, we went on the WDW tower of terror. I hated it! He, otoh, loved it. I think Ist him do it again on his own. One of few times that seeing my kid’s delight was not enough to make me happy. That thing was awful.

  11. Growing up, our extended family was all in PA/NY, so we often made the 2-day drive from MN in our trusty Caravan (faux paneling and all). We would just stay at a motel close to wherever we were when my dad got tired of driving on day 1.

    We also did a number of CO ski vacations (some driving, some flying); my mom was always miserable the first few days due to altitude sickness (and she doesn’t like skiing). We loved it, though—my dad bribed us with m&ms on the runs and hot cocoa breaks to minimize complaints about the cold, and my sister and I liked to sing silly songs on the chairlift. When not singing, we often met interesting people on the lifts (other family trios or solos). And the apres-ski hot tub was always a hit!

  12. I never heard of a Holidome, but it looks like it was a lot of fun. We didn’t take a vacation during the winter. We went to Lake George every year in the fall for a long weekend. I still have a necklace that is made from a tree with a smiley face that I got in LG. We never stayed in a Howard Johnson’s but we used to eat in one every year in Lake George. Whenever I see an old Ho Jo building, it brings back memories of my childhood even though most of the remaining Ho Jo buildings are repurposed into some other business or restaurant.

  13. Never heard of Holidomes, but I do have vague memories of an indoor pool with plants somewhere that we all thought was the height of luxury.
    Most of our neighbors didn’t take vacations as such, just trips to see relatives, but we made the long trek to the Outer Banks a half dozen times. Staying in a Holiday Inn along the way was a huge bonus because of the pool — the ancient house we rented every year had no TV, a/c, dishwasher, let alone a pool. (“Why do you need a pool when you have the OCEAN?” was the parental response when we whined for a pool).
    We also loved the ice and soda machines, because soda was verboten in our house and ice cubes had to be laboriously made with metal ice cube trays.
    These trips were also the only times we were taken to McDonald’s or other fast food restaurants. But, as Bill Cosby used to say, we were thankful.

  14. Our summer vacays were a week with relatives in Wisconsin, sometimes spending a night with mom’s childhood best friend in Chicago, and a week at the beach, usually Nag’s Head. Exceptions were the year we went to Maine & Boston, and the year we rented a Winnebego to drive to Yellowstone and Glacier park. No Holidomes. But we did sometimes take staycations at the Marriott or the state park lodge, each an hour away in a different direction. They had pools and game rooms. A hot tub at the lodge and a sauna at the Marriott (maybe a whirlpool there too, not sure).
    My son was not so big on swimming or the overstimulus of a game room.

  15. There were two seminal childhood vacation memories. Going to Florida to visit my grandparents and getting to sit in the cockpit and get my plastic wings. And a trip to DC where we stayed at a Marriott and I was maybe 9 sitting in the hot tub with some of the businessmen and I thought to myself, “If I could grow up to be a businessman that traveled around, that would be the most amazing thing ever.”

  16. Lauren,
    We went to Howard Johnson’s too, and had to be sure to order HoJo Cola because they didn’t have coke. But they did have those great hot dogs on the squarish buns. “Someone you know wherever you go….”

  17. My SIL used to take her kids and grandkids to Holidomes in the midwest. They all loved it. I stayed in a Holiday Inn with a Holidome once, but it was on a business trip and I didn’t get to do any fun things. I could see that it would be a total blast, though, if you were the right age and had some other kids around.

  18. The two girls in the middle are family friends with whom we frequently vacationed in the 60s. Obviously their mom had better taste in swim caps. My mom always went for the boring ones. God, how those old caps squeezed my head and pulled at my hair.

  19. I only flew on a plane once in my childhood – our only trip to WDW. I am sure my dad had a conference there. That was the reason for most of our trips outside of visiting family or camping – we would tag along to a conference. This one was special as we actually flew.

    We would go visit relatives every summer and at Christmas at a minimum. We always stopped at Big Boy. (I think it was the Marc’s Big Boy variation in Southern Wisconsin.) My brother got car sick when he was little, even with Dramamine, so there was always the excitement of whether or not we’d have to stop along some 2-lane road in Wisconsin to clean up puke. UGH. I can still smell it if I close my eyes.

    I don’t think I’ve ever eaten at HoJo.

    When we road trip now as a family, we usually either pack a lunch or go to Chick Fil A. McDonald’s if it is for breakfast on a Sunday. Road trips are different than in my childhood as the interstate system is much larger. Not as much driving through small towns on 2-lane roads.

  20. RMS – yes, every motel required a pool. One year we did a trip to Michigan’s Upper Pennisula. There were not a lot of options (still aren’t), but my parents went out of their way to find motels with pools. I didn’t care that they were unheated. On another trip in Kentucky, we stayed one night at a Days Inn, and then the rest of the trip at another Days Inn because we drove by it and noticed that pool was so much better.

  21. I can practically see the hot dogs and the buns at HoJos. I still think dessert was the best part of a meal at their restaurants. Pie and of course the best part was their ice cream.

  22. We went to the Jersey shore every summer for a week or two. My mom would always insist we leave early on Saturday morning because she wanted the extra day at the beach, so we’d sit in traffic for 4 hours to get there. We could’ve left at noon and gotten there in two hours.

    We had two big road trips with my dad. One was out west, we flew to Denver and went up to Yellowstone, then down through Utah and Bryce and Zion, then the Grand Canyon and back up to Denver. I remember almost every hotel/motel had a game room of some sort, I don’t recall seeing many of those now. The other trip we starting in NJ, went up to Niagara Falls, then Toronto, Montreal and Quebec City, and down through Maine and Boston.

  23. When we moved here in 1990 my boss at the time referred to there being some meeting I needed to go to at the Holidome. I had to look it up. Now it’s the same building but a Doubletree.

    Vacations I remember:
    5yo – 3 weeks in the back of our pink Oldsmobile station wagon CA – Milwaukee – Muskogee, OK – Dallas – Disneyland – home. Highlights: camping in Yellowstone and breakfast one morning at the Yellowstone Lodge where my mom ordered prune juice for us all to drink. My sister says loudly for the whole restaurant to hear “I know why we’re having prune juice!” Still a family story. Mt. Rushmore. Seeing my dad’s relatives in Milwaukee, Muscatine IA, Muskogee (they had a working ranch so I got to ride a horse for the first time), Dallas. All the windows in the station wagon got destroyed in a sand storm in AZ. Honestly don’t remember anything about Disneyland.
    10yo (winter) – Tahoe to visit one of my mom’s cousins (so my 2nd cousin) and her husband. Got to drive a snowmobile by myself. The most fun ever.
    10yo (spring) – trip to Disneyland w/Mom, Sis, Grandmom. This was before the days of unlimited rides for one price of admission so I had my own ticket book. Well, I got separated from the others, but, hey, no big deal, I had my ticket book. A great afternoon. When I was out of tickets I went to the lost kid station. I also met Joe DiMaggio that day and got his autograph. He was at the park with the other Oakland A’s coaches and my mom recognized him.
    12yo – Train trip to Portland to see “cousins”. The family of my mom’s best friend from her youth.
    14yo – Yosemite over Easter break. I really didn’t want to go because I missed a week of HS baseball practices and games, which is the reason I’m now not in the baseball hall of fame. It was the first time I skiied.

  24. This was before the days of unlimited rides for one price of admission so I had my own ticket book.

    E Tickets! They were the good ones. Weird Al has a line in his Jurassic Park song:

    “Well this sure ain’t no E ticket
    Think I’ll tell them where to stick it”

    and I have wondered if anyone under age 50 even knows what he’s talking about.

  25. Ticket books. This could be a standardized test question because you had to strategize and then determine the rides that were worth the extra tickets. I also had to negotiate with my brother since we went on the rides together.

  26. My family seems to have vacationed like DD’s. When we lived back east, it was time at the Jersey shore. Later it was Yellowstone (where my brother and I convinced our younger sister to run off the walkways toward a hot spring, and that ended the day’s activities). I got car sick, which made these driving vacations extra fun. Once we moved, most years we flew back to see family so just stayed with relatives. I do distinctly remember a giant elephant at a Margate, NJ motel. We never went to Disney but went to MidAmerica or something close to that, and Six Flags. Were there more motels then, or was that just my family’s price point? We rarely stayed at hotels. Also being in mid-America, we did Branson, Lake of the Ozarks and Silver Dollar City a few times. I also went there with friends’ families as a teen. No Holidome, but we stayed at lake front cabins with a pool and rec center with pinball machines and pool tables, where I played Devil Went Down to Georgia scores of times on the jukebox. When we met my mom’s twin’s family for vacations in the middle of the country, the adults would go entertain themselves, my brother and three boy cousins the same age as my brother and me would all go shoot pool or to the lake, and I was assigned to stay at the condo and babysit my sister and young cousin. As a budding feminist, I was a super good sport about it and a complete delight to be around on those trips. I’m pretty sure I had to do the dishes after dinners for 11 while the boys got to go wander around. I feel like I need to go make a mess and have my son clean it up now.

  27. I was about 10 years old and went with my aunt, uncle & cousin to Disney. Cousin is an only child, we are only a year apart and were frequent playmates, so I was fortunate to be invited along on the trip.

    Vivid memory: while we were there, the hotel key got locked in the room. The hotel office wasn’t open, so my uncle used a credit card to jimmy open the door. I was amazed! This may be where my “solve your own problem” ethos started.

  28. What was the deal with swim caps? I remember them being mandatory when I was little, and then they just went away.

  29. My mother was USDistrict Court reporter in DC. DC emptied out from mid July thru Labor Day in those days and tge Court was not in session for at least four weeks, might have been six. We woukd go to Chicago, and for a few years took a long road trip with my maiden aunts. The highlight for me was the drive. I had the triptik . We always broke the trip at Sandusky point, no visit to the amusement park , but Mom would put the quarters into the magic Fingers bed. She was so innocent she had no idea of the connotations. It was nice to spend time with her, but there were no cousin children. Once those long work vacations were a thing of the past, no more long trips and weeks of day or overnight camp, which I despised. I disliked being a child, hit puberty very early, left home at 16, and have zero nostalgia.

  30. I disliked being a child,

    In addition to disliking it, I also wasn’t very good at it.

    I’m also struck by the relative modesty of everyone’s background. No boats or summer homes for example.

  31. You guys are bringing back so many memories!

    Dramamine, and my big sister always in the front passenger seat, pulling over so she could “pant like a puppy dog!” Mom in back with me, little sister in the ‘way back, wearing my dad’s Air Force jump harness which was somehow attached to the car, in lieu of a seat belt. We always had a thermos jug of ice water that our mom ruled over judiciously. No extra bathroom stops for our family!

    Denver, why have a whole game room when you can get Frogger on your phone? We had pin ball machines where we swam in town, but air hockey was special. If there was a pro league, I’d be in it.

    HoJos ice cream!

    There was a Big Boy on the main drag in our town. We rarely went there, but one time the waitress dumped a salad on me, so I had to go to the kitchen to wash off the dressing. I’m sure there were bathrooms and have no idea why I didn’t just go there, but I thought it was pretty cool to go into that big kitchen.

    Becky, good thing there were only girls in our family. I was the closest to a boy.

    Rocky, why the caps? I remember we had to wear them at GS camp; I hated them. Later, on swim team, I went for the Lycra.

    We went to WDW with tickets from a guy at the local coca-cola bottlers. I don’t remember much of it. Kim, the Jetsons were Disney?

    Every four years we flew to AZ to visit my mom’s sister over Thanksgiving or Christmas, until my cousins were out of college, around when I finished MS. Flying was very cool and very special—we dressed up, of course.

  32. My mom worked at a nearby college when I was a kid, and they had a system,pre-VRBO, where you could rent your house to parents of graduating seniors and get out of town for a week. This is how we were able to pay for Disney World when I was in K. Two years later, I was in 2nd grade and my grandfather was terminally ill with cancer, having moved out to AZ a year earlier. So we rented the house again and bought all the plane tickets and that was the first trip out to the American West for any of us. Looking at the mountains and rocks and saguaro cacti, my mom kept marveling “it’s like we’re in another country.” We made a side trip to the Grand Canyon during that week.

    But by and large, we didn’t do a regular week long vacation. Three or four days at Virginia Beach maybe, a day at Ocean City, stuff like that.

    When I was maybe 9, my dad took me with him to visit his favorite uncle and the branch of his cousins who were and still are on Long Island (they were early Levittown residents). My mom had some work things, and my brother had soccer camp.

    We swam in the ocean and the waves were the biggest I’d seen. My dad’s explanation was that the beach faced south. We rented boogie boards, because they hadn’t developed the dirt cheap foam kind. There was a big family dinner on the uncle’s back patio, and I held someone’s baby, which must have been a first for me.

  33. “ No boats or summer homes for example.”

    My dad had a sailboat we’d put in the back of the station wagon, flag on the end of the mast. It was a little bigger than a sunfish; the centerboard was probably 4’x1’. I think all 3 kids could fit in it with him, but there usually just me & one sister. Sometimes we’d hang on the edge, waist & legs in the water. That’s probably not the kind of boat you mean. He might’ve bought it at Sears.

  34. My vacations were limited as a kid. My parents were homebodies. We took trips overseas to visit relatives and there were several years when we went to a resort in the Catskills. I don’t think we ever stayed in hotel, other than the Catskills resort. I went to Disney for the first time when I was a few years out of college. I remember a Howard Johnson in Times Square but it closed in the ’80’s.

    I like to travel. When I graduated college in the mid-80’s, it was popular for graduates to backpack around Europe for several months before starting their post-college careers. I was no exception, although I had to work for a year first in order to finance the trip.

  35. Oh those horrible swim caps! When I would take it off half my hair came along with it!

    My grandma would have us suck on half a lemon when we got carsick. Old world remedy and I have no clue if it worked. When I was about ten my 82 yo grandma took four of us on a bus trip from Texas to California to visit my aunt and cousins. Grandma was a tough cookie.

  36. Back in the 90’s,I stayed at the Holidome in Albany. It was pretty cool. We also did Great Wolf once when the boys were 3 and 5. And we often stayed at those campgrounds, like Jellystone, that have fancy pools and water slides

  37. Kim, no shade on your grandma, but for such a long trip with kids, I’d much rather take a bus than drive!

  38. “Growing up truly middle class, we didn’t have money for vacations until I was in middle school.”
    That was us, although my grandmother lived in FL, close to the beach, so we would go there for Christmas or school spring break. My parents said, though, that it wasn’t a vacation for them because they had to deal with my grandparents. Once when I was in elementary school, my father went to a conference in Gatlinberg and we went too and stayed at the motel and swam in the pool. When we lived in Germany we took lots of day trips, and even went overnight to Paris once. Other than that, we mostly did weekend camping.

  39. We also had to drive across the country ever summer for my father’s summer research gig. We stayed at plenty of motels, but never, ever, ever were we able to use the motel pool. Why? Because we would pull into the motel around 8 or 9pm, bags of McDonalds in our hands, crash, and then be on the road by 6am the next morning. God, I hated those trips. That is why I try to avoid “car vacations” and detest McDonalds to this day. Although the year they didn’t have enough money for fast food was even worse – they had a cooler in the car with that frickin’ spray cheese, and we sprayed the stuff on crackers for lunch instead of getting fast food.

  40. We had a small sailboat (J22) until I was about 10. When we kids were little, a rope would be looped through our life vest and we’d be plopped in the water so we could swim alongside the boat. I’m assuming we were anchored, but I have happy memories of it feeling like the boat was moving, too. Lots of milfoil though…I can still feel the slime!

  41. I puked in the car a LOT as a kid. I always got to sit in the front seat as a result – my youngest sibling was relegated to the back with my mom, and my other sibling next to me would yell at me for singing too loudly into the windshield. ;) When I was pregnant I had really bad motion sickness too – one day when I had to stand at the front of the T car and get out at a stop along the way and then back on to avoid throwing up, I had DH drive me to work the rest of the time!

  42. My vacations in the home country were to the cool hill stations in the summer. As I got older we went to the beach. In my teens my parents bought a house in the country side and we went there.
    The hill station holidays are fond memories. We were sometimes accompanied by another family. We stayed in a hotel that still had vestiges of British influence. You got tea delivered at say 7.00 am. Then you took your time, getting showered and dressed and had to come to the dining room for breakfast. It was sit down where you got toast with butter and home made jam and fresh honey. Eggs could be ordered as you liked. There was usually hot tea and fresh fruit. The jams and honey were small industries in these hill stations. There were many flower beds all around to attract the bees. During the day there was boating on the lake, horse riding, picking strawberries or strolling in the market to buy hand made woolens or bed spreads. There were also hand crafted leather shoes and bags. If you returned to the hotel in the afternoon the head waiter sounded a huge gong for lunch. Lunch again was a sit down affair. Soup, main course and dessert. Afternoon tea with biscuits was brought to your room. There was also a game room as well as a playground. No pool. The hotel would pack a picnic if you wanted to go off on your own for the day. Dinner was again sit down. We used to meet people who vacationed there summer after summer. When I saw Dirty Dancing I was reminded of the hotel.
    Our later beach vacations were at a resort with bungalows. I loved it so much that I tried persuading my parents to let me stay alone there for a week. This was a more teen/adult setting.
    Later on my parents had a country house. It was almost like camping but with amenities. It was always filled with family and friends, a lot of work for us the hosts and therefore my least favorite. Other people though have good memories as guests.

  43. We took a road trip of about 1300 miles one summer to visit grandma. I was 7, brother was 9. My parents promised they would take us to a movie (IN A THEATER!) if we read the whole book Gremlins. (Didn’t know there was a book? Of course you didn’t know. It was written after the movie, basically someone describing every scene from the movie. Terrible, just terrible. My parents didn’t actually read or like books, so how would they know what to pick?) The book was bout 400 pages (in my memory). My brother read it out loud, as it was not quite at my level. It must have taken 20 hours or more.

    The best part of the trip was seeing Gremlins in the theater when we got back. It might have been my first real movie.

  44. The “big” vacation I remember was the summer I was 6. My mom was teaching in Houston and was divorced, and she just decided we’d drive around the country in her little Triumph Spitfire. I remember seeing bison, San Francisco, and Crater Lake in particular, but mostly I remember driving with a bandana on my head (just like mom!) and my arm out the passenger window.

    Other than that, my “vacations” were mostly visiting family — driving with my Granny from Indiana down to Georgia, driving to/from Indiana/MD to pick up/drop off my stepsibs, taking the bus or driving to/from my dad’s, traveling to/from Louisville to see Grandma, etc. I got carsick, so I couldn’t read, and I’m sure I was a complete delight. Either we’d drive through or my mom would stop in whatever cheap hotel we could find with room, and if it had a pool, that was the highlight of the trip. My mom did NOT believe in fast food, though, so I’d whine for Stuckeys, and she’d break out the cooler. I also learned to look for bathrooms on the RIGHT side of the road, because she refused to ever cross over or backtrack. ;-) The trips with my Granny, OTOH, were pretty awesome, except when I needed to share the back seat with my cousin (we’d pick her up in TN) — Granny always took me to Waffle House.

    We also traveled a lot for my mom’s research in the summer, but we usually camped. The big events were when we’d go to FL to see my great-grandparents and go to the beach. They *totally* spoiled me. We’d go to WDW a few times, but I remember preferring Busch Gardens, because they had these machines that would make a wax animal that you could take with you. It was a real treat to have somone buy me the kind of crap my mom never word.

    By MS, I had a friend with a condo in Ocean City, so I got to go visit there. By MS/HS, my folks were doing well enough to rent a place in Lewes for a week — not on the beach, but walkable to both the beach and their little town there. And then in HS or college, they bought the condo, so we started going there.

    I think college was when the real traveling started — between better financial situations and my parents probably becoming conscious of their more limited time with me, we started more planned big vacation-ey type events. My dad started doing ski trips in CO that he’d fly me out for over spring break, my mom and stepdad started going to St. Maarten’s and Puerto Rico and such and periodically took us kids along, etc. My mom had always had the occasional work trip — I remember in particular their excitement over a conference in southern Italy — but of course we weren’t invited to those!

  45. “I’m also struck by the relative modesty of everyone’s background. No boats or summer homes for example.”

    I remember being in awe of the families that went to Colorado every spring break to ski, went to WDW multiple times, rented beach houses, went to tropical locations, and spend weekends in the nearest big cities (KC, Chicago, Minneapolis) just to go “school shopping”. People who went on planes once a year. That kind of thing was out of our reach. But looking back, we were probably pretty close to the middle of my diverse town – there were plenty of people who didn’t even go visit relatives (who were probably all local anyway).

    Air travel was significantly more expensive in the 80’s and 90’s of course.

  46. “Air travel was significantly more expensive in the 80’s and 90’s of course.”

    How old were you when you took your first flight?

  47. I think the deal with swim caps is that the pool filters weren’t as good back in the day so hair would clog them more easily.

  48. “How old were you when you took your first flight?”

    5 — and it was solo! My mom and dad had moved to TX, my grandma was still in Louisville, so my grandma put me on a plane to come see her. It was very exciting — I remember the wings and feeling VERY grown-up.

  49. Yes, the swim cap thing was supposedly about the pool filters. I have my doubts. I think there was some kind of weird women’s modesty thing involved. Around about 1964, men started growing their hair long (at least in the Bay Area). Women started complaining to the pool management that the men should have to wear caps too. But of course you couldn’t insist on anything like that for men, so they just dropped the cap requirement altogether.

  50. “How old were you when you took your first flight?”

    I was an infant going to meet my grandparents who had just moved to Florida.

    This was way before my time of course.

    Turbulence smerbulence!

  51. “I remember being in awe of the families that went to Colorado every spring break to ski, went to WDW multiple times, rented beach houses, went to tropical locations, and spend weekends in the nearest big cities (KC, Chicago, Minneapolis) just to go “school shopping”. People who went on planes once a year.”

    I never knew anyone who flew once a year. I had flown once as a 3 year old because my grandmother died and we had to go to the funeral. And then we flew to Germany. When I flew to France when I was an exchange student, I flew with 5 other American teens, none of whom had ever been on any flight before so they thought I was the “knowledgable” one. My DH took his first flight after he graduated from college.
    As for boats, my grandfather in FL had a small motorboat for a while because he was super into fishing. But he never used it because he usually fished from a pier, so he got rid of it after about 3 years. We had some friends in WA that had a larger motorboat and we went out with them on the Columbia River a couple of times. That was the sum total of my boat experience until my DH and I bought a canoe in the late 90’s

  52. “How old were you when you took your first flight?”

    My one childhood trip was when I was 7 or 8 (early 80’s). I didn’t fly anywhere again until the late 90’s for work.

  53. “I remember being in awe of the families that went to Colorado every spring break to ski, went to WDW multiple times, rented beach houses, went to tropical locations, and spend weekends in the nearest big cities (KC, Chicago, Minneapolis) just to go “school shopping”. People who went on planes once a year.”

    I did not know anyone who did any of those things. It wasn’t until law school that I met truly UMC peers. The whole idea of “spring break” was also something foreign. Our K-12 school system didn’t have such a thing — we got Good Friday off, I think, and that was it. Christmas vacation was short, usually not beginning until December 23, and depending upon where Christmas fell on the calendar, we were often back in school on January 2.

  54. “How old were you when you took your first flight?”

    I was a baby, but that was only because my parents were going to Greece to introduce my brother and me to his family (who were all still there). My dad immigrated to the U.S. in 1953, and he didn’t return to Greece until that trip (which was in 1968).

  55. I went to a fancy private school, and it wasn’t at all unusual for kids there to do a week or two in Florida or the Caribbean in March, a couple of weeks in Europe in the summer, and a week of skiing in the winter. I was pretty jealous of them. Most years, the biggest trip we did was to drive down to Delaware from Boston to see my mom’s brother and his family.

  56. “How old were you when you took your first flight?”

    I’ve been told it was when I was an infant.

    Flying was not a big deal for me. For much of my childhood, we lived on a different island than my grandparents, so we often flew to visit them during school breaks. My mom’s BFF lived on a different island, so we flew there multiple times too.

    Back then, it was mostly in DC-3s. I remember walking across the runway, entering the plane near the tail, and walking uphill to our seats. The stewardesses would give us two-packs of chiclets, and my sibs and I would usually just chew one on the flight and save the other one for later. Once we were seated, we always had to make sure there was an ‘air sickness bag’ in the seat pocket in front, just in case.

    I also remember the weigh-ins that were part of the check in process.

  57. “Christmas vacation was short, usually not beginning until December 23, and depending upon where Christmas fell on the calendar, we were often back in school on January 2.”
    That is what we had, and what my kids have too. I think they are back on Jan 3 this year. However, their school district has that crazy “winter break” in addition to spring break. I never understood that one. I think they only do it in the Northeast

  58. “Around about 1964, men started growing their hair long (at least in the Bay Area). Women started complaining to the pool management that the men should have to wear caps too. But of course you couldn’t insist on anything like that for men, so they just dropped the cap requirement altogether.”

    OTOH, around that same time, I remember pool rules that anyone with hair longer than a certain length had to wear caps. There was one boy in my class with long hair, and he had to wear a cap when our class had swimming for PE.

  59. “However, their school district has that crazy “winter break” in addition to spring break. I never understood that one. I think they only do it in the Northeast”

    Do you mean the ski week some schools have in February? I’d never heard of it before I started reading TOS. Schools here don’t have that.

    IIRC, SBJ has said her DS’ school(s) also had that break, so I don’t think it’s only in the northeast.

  60. “Christmas vacation was short, usually not beginning until December 23, and depending upon where Christmas fell on the calendar, we were often back in school on January 2.”

    I think that’s how it was for us when I was very young. But sometime while I was in elementary school that changed to a 2 week break.

  61. I think my first flight was when we went to Portland when I was 12 over Christmas. I remember watching the Minnesota Vikings’ playoff game in Minnesota and the announcers were making their usual big deal about how Bud Grant, the coach of the Vikings, never let his players wear any warm-up gear when they were on the bench.

    I know I flew again the next summer when I was 13 because my grandma took me to Seattle and then on a cruise through the inside passage of Alaska.

  62. “Great Wolf Lodge and Gaylord resorts are today’s Holidomes.”

    Locally, there’s Aulani resort, which may be a bit upscale relative to the Holidomes.

  63. S&M – my brother claimed the stupid carsickness thing too. I was stuck in the back with mom. I still think he made it up. The only upside is that I could put my head in her lap and lie down to sleep.

    We always drove and camped. My dad had work conventions every summer so we would always just drive to wherever that was. I think it was probably 3-4 weeks we were gone because we always took our time getting there and saw all the sights along the way. I always dreamed of staying in a hotel like the Holiday Inn. So fancy. But we camped. I love it more in retrospect than I did at the time.

    We never took a family spring break trip. Spring break meant no school and muck around the neighborhood with the other kids.

    Oh also auto bingo. Loved auto bingo and opening and closing those tiny windows on the cards. I also hated how whenever we got to a big city my dad would yell “turn the radio down” and i was like ‘what does that have to do with driving?” of course now, I turn down the radio when I need to navigate or think.

  64. “my first real movie.”

    I remember mine. When I was very young, we lived across the street from the theater, and one Sunday my mom decided to take me and my sister to a matinee showing of Gunga Din. I think I was about 3, and I mostly remember that it gave me the creeps.

    My second was Mary Poppins, which is still one of my favorites.

  65. We didn’t have the Feb break when I was a kid, We received two holidays in Feb. One was for Lincoln’s bday and the other was for Washington’s bday. The energy crisis was the reason that we got a week off as a trial for one year. It wasn’t permanent until the teachers asked to make it an official break. Some NY schools are starting to move away from a full week for the winter break and a lot of schools in NJ are actually starting to add it to their calendars. NJ has a teacher convention thing in November that uses up a bunch of days in early November.

  66. “E Tickets!… I have wondered if anyone under age 50 even knows what he’s talking about.”

    Yes, e-tickets mean something totally different to most young people now.

    But I do recall that Jay Leno used to refer to “E-ticket rides” from time to time.

  67. “We received two holidays in Feb. One was for Lincoln’s bday and the other was for Washington’s bday.”

    I remember having both days as holidays, and then being bummed when they were combined into a single holiday.

  68. “The “big” vacation I remember was the summer I was 6.”

    Ditto. That was my only childhood trip OOS; I think my dad saved about 3 years of vacation to use on that one trip.

    “I think college was when the real traveling started”

    Ditto again. Interview trips were my first OOS trips after the one childhood trip. Once I moved to the continent, there were regular trips back home, and once I finished grad school there were annual week-long ski trips with friends.

  69. Jeez, I was carsick all the time and never got to ride up front. Dad drove, Mom sat in the passenger seat, and Sis and I rode in the back, with me periodically throwing up. The rule about adults in the front seat was iron-clad.

  70. I’ve had amazing childhood vacations. The most memorable one for me was my grandparents took us to WDW when it had just opened. I was like 7 years old and my sister was 10. We flew from Caracas to Miami by ourselves and met our grandparents who flew from San Juan. We then flew to Orlando and stayed at the Contemporary Resort, which was completely out of this world futuristic to us at that time. The whole thing just blew my mind, especially, EPCOT. My grandparents bought me a stuffed Winnie the Pooh that I carried around for months.

  71. “These trips were also the only times we were taken to McDonald’s or other fast food restaurants.”

    My first experience with McD was in Ft. Collins during my one childhood trip OOS (18 cent hamburgers IIRC). It would be several years before any McD locations opened here.

    Perhaps this was the start of me wanting to try fast food places and chain eateries that don’t have locations here.

  72. “These trips were also the only times we were taken to McDonald’s or other fast food restaurants.”

    My first experience with McD was in Ft. Collins during my one childhood trip OOS (18 cent hamburgers IIRC). It would be several years before any McD locations opened here.

    Perhaps this was the start of me wanting to try fast food places that don’t have locations here.

  73. “We kids loved motel pools almost as much as any other aspect of the vacation.”

    During my one childhood trip OOS, my parents planned things so we’d often pull into a motel late in the afternoon, check in, and my sibs and I would then head straight for the pool, and my dad, who did all the driving, would relax in the room.

    Then we’d go back to the room, shower and change, and head to dinner, usually at Denny’s. We stayed at a lot of Travelodges on the trip, and it seemed like there was always a Denny’s right next door.

  74. “ All of them are now self mapping with the exception of the e5. I have the i7.”

    Thanks. I bought the i8, which is the Costco version of the i7, for $579 before tax.

    After 16 years of marriage, we still find ways to be romantic.

  75. The February break, aka Presidents’ Week, ski week, winter break, was not a thing for me until the energy crisis of 1973-74 which is when OPEC flexed their muscles and oil prices quadrupled from $3 to $12/bbl, in turn causing the cost of heating e.g. school buildings to jump. So they decided to close schools for a week and save all that energy cost. I don’t know if that’s also when the week off started in much colder parts of the country. Before that, which was also before the “Presidents’ Day” holiday was created we got Lincoln’s and Washington’s birthdays off.

    For that matter, neither was Easter week a thing. We got Good Friday off.

    But Christmas break was a described by Scarlett. Even if Christmas & New Years we on Wednesdays I don’t think we got the full 2 weeks off. Maybe all week of Christmas but we’d certainly be back at school by Jan 2. People didn’t travel as much then.

  76. The discussion about heating schools reminds me of a conversation I had this month with another Scout parent who is a custodian at a local 100+ year old elementary school building. He mentioned that they had a train boiler (vs. a regular old boiler) for a while for heating the school and how he troubleshot/maintained the boiler and associated steam piping. He seemed to enjoy that part of his job.

  77. “We also did a number of CO ski vacations (some driving, some flying); my mom was always miserable the first few days due to altitude sickness”

    I’m guessing she didn’t take Diamox.

    If I ever take another ski trip to CO, besides taking Diamox, I’d probably stay at least a couple days in/near Denver first to try and minimize the altitude sickness.

    But with so many lower altitude options available, I don’t know that I’ll ever ski in CO again.

  78. Two of my good friends through school were more UMC than I was. In both cases, their parents were older, or at least their dads were. One family kind of came from some money, and all their grandparents had died.

    One had a boat like this, more or less

    And the other had a Hatteras just like this:

    I can’t get a good picture to copy, but looking through that listing brings back memories. The interior layout is the same, except the forward berth where my friend and I slept had bunks on top of each other.

    The first kid went to places like the Bahamas, and a limo would pick them up to drive them to the airport. The second kid went in ski trips and they owned their own equipment.

  79. My youngest loves hotels more than anything else. I’ve think I’ve mentioned before how we go on annual ski trips out west, rent a beautiful house (sometimes with a hot tub, but not always), and generally spend a small fortune. But her favorite part of the trip is the hotel stay on the last day (closer to the airport for a 6am flight!). She loves that it is one big room, with big beds to jump on, and a pool. We have to make sure we arrive at the hotel early enough for pool time. One year the pool was closed for maintenance and she just about lost it, causing me to lose it at the front desk, and getting a free nights stay, plus HH points!

  80. Update on my student. It snowed again Sunday night, but the roads weren’t too bad Monday morning. She came 45 minutes late, but I cut her some slack because of the snow. She was scheduled to come again today, I told her to meet me at 8:30. At 7:40 she texted me asking if she could come at 9 because she was “just dead exhausted.” At 8:55 she texted again to ask if she could be excused for the day, and if she can have one more chance to come tomorrow. I told her she can, but if she is late or cancels one more time then we’re done.

    I emailed her clinical coordinator to let her know. She said when she talked to the student on Friday, she made it very clear she needs to treat this like a job and be reliable, so she is going to talk to the course faculty about it to see if they should let her continue with the rotation or not. At this point, I’m not sure she’ll even be able to get in enough hours by the end of the semester.

  81. “Two of my good friends through school were more UMC than I was. In both cases, their parents were older, or at least their dads were.”

    My guess is that there’s a broad correlation between parents’ age and kids’ SES.

  82. That was a big part of it. But the family money was, too, for the ones with the bigger boat. They had seven degrees from Cornell between the two of them, all framed in the home office, where we could play on the Mac.

  83. It’s ironic that several of you mention the OPEC Oil crisis in your vacation memories. The way my dad reached UMC (and funded our nice vacations) in a bit more than a decade, after fleeing Cuba with nothing was to work his way up by accepting any assignment overseas. He was posted to Venezuela by a US Oil co. which then had the Oil Boom (it wasn’t called a crisis there.)

  84. On-topic: Actually, I think my first flight was as a baby — my Granny has pics of us with me as like a toddler on a plane around NY or something.

    Totally off-topic truffle update: I emailed Baldor, and they are crediting me the difference between the price on the website and the price they charged me! I am SO impressed with their customer service — totally going to be ordering more from them going forward. I’m so pleased to find that I’m in their “local” area for delivery from the DC store.

  85. Rhett – similar to your photos but not so large or the foothills of the Himalayas.
    My one overseas vacation as a teen was with my aunt in Egypt. My aunt and uncle drove my cousin and myself to places they knew of. It wasn’t a tour where we stopped at every archeological site. It was quite Totebaggy because I came back and talked to my class about it. I missed a chance to visit Rome when my other aunt and uncle were posted there. My parents would never allow me to go on shopping trips to Dubai or Bangkok like some of their friends kids did. I wasn’t interested either.

    My kids have two weeks of Christmas break and about a week of Spring Break at Easter. School ends in June first week normally. Spring Break feels extremely liberating because we have good weather by then. My kids are ready for break after tomorrow as there were Covid cases at DD’s school, we tested her, since she was contact traced as exposed. Relief at the negative test result. The school has chugged along F2F far longer than anyone expected. I call it Le Grand Experiment.

  86. My first flight was as a two week old infant. The adoption was privately arranged, so when I was born they flew to Chicago and were the ones to pick me up from the hospital nursery. Mom and I stayed in Chicago until I was legal to fly. She had me in a large wicker Moses basket with handles, and had purchased a ticket for the basket so she could be comfortable on the then 4 plus hour non jet flight home. When she settled in the stewardess said, Im sure she’ll be fine, just let me know if she looks a little blue. The basket stayed empty and Mom clutched me searching my face for changes in color for the entire flight. We had that basket for storage until I was in high school.

  87. “He mentioned that they had a train boiler (vs. a regular old boiler) for a while for heating the school and how he troubleshot/maintained the boiler and associated steam piping”

    Our grade school had a boiler room. The kids who walked to school had to wait IN the boiler room if we got there before school started on winter days. The fancy bus riders got to wait in the cafeteria. I can’t imagine the hue and cry over safety and unequal treatment were that to be the case today. I kinda loved it.

  88. Thanks Milo. Now Im thinking of roomba couple getting romantic. Arg.

    Lolly, fancy bus riders? I always thought it was super-cool when kids could walk to school. There were two in my year in grade school, one in my year in MS.

    This is what the train boiler reminds me of

  89. I think I was 6 or 7 when I first flew – we went to my grandparents’ in Florida. We would go there every year over April break. We always had February break too, but we never went anywhere ‘fun’ then – mostly just a lot of sledding on the giant hill near our house.

  90. I was 12 when i took my first flight and I didn’t go on a plane again until I was in college. One trip to WDW and that was it for plane rides until I was 18. My maternal grandmother lived to 99 and she never went on a plane. My maternal grandfather went on a plane because he was in Italy for WWII, but he was never interested in travel except by car. They went on vacation once or twice a year for a few days at a time. To Maine, Poconos or Lake George and that was it.

    I think both of my parents were amazed when I used to travel so much for work. If I was working on a deal in California, I would travel there at lest 2 -4 times in a month week. I used to fly round trip to Denver in a day to see a client. They still think of flying as exotic, but it is like bus travel to me since I used to fly all of the time.I think this is why I still can’t believe that 2020 is coming to close and I won’t even have one air adventure in this calendar year.

  91. Catching up on all the posts – they were fun to read.

    Thanks MM. No, the trip was not make-a-wish. This was back in the 70s. Looks like make a wish was founded in 1980. My parents used the money they’d put aside for college for my sister on the trip instead.

    Rhett – I absolutely love that 9 year old you thought “if I could grow up to be a businessman that traveled around, that would be the most amazing thing ever” – and you did!

    Louise. the hill station hotel vacations sound amazing.

    Seattle schools have “mid-winter” break – a week in February around Presidents Day weekend.

  92. First my dad was at sea in the navy and then he was in law school. Money was extremely tight until he passed the bar when I was 5. The three of us went from Durham to San Diego by car on about $50. We stayed in cheap motels, and my mom would cook dinner on a hot plate. My only memory of that trip was watching a mosquito bite my arm and heading west toward a long range of mountains at sunset with the skyline filled by pumping oil derricks.

    In San Diego, we were the destination for many friends and relatives. One year I remember going to Disneyland 5 times with different east coast visitors. For many years my Dad used his two week vacation from his law job to do his Navy reserves active duty. So no week-long vacations, but we would take weekend road trips up to San Francisco or Hearst Castle. We would occasionally fly back east for family special events. I don’t remember my first plane flight, but it was probably when I was 8 or 9 years old. When I was in 8th grade we went to Oahu and stayed at the Royal Hawaiian and then went on to Maui where we stayed in some condo near Lahaina.

    My family likes roller coasters. We rode the roller coasters at Magic Mountain, and even road tripped up to Mountain View to go to Marriott’s Great America. One constant theme to a lot of these travels was my dad talking on the phone. Since this was pre-cell phones, that meant talking on a pay phone. I have memories of sitting on a curb watching the It’s a Small World clock for more than an hour while my dad was on the phone, and another time being stuck hanging out near a pay phone on Pier 39. People still pay him to talk on the phone, only now he’s attached to his iPhone. My mother calls his iPhone “the other woman”.

    DH’s father made an RV type vehicle out of a standard truck that was called “Daddy Truck”. DH’s family would take that from Orange County to the midwest and back. His family did a lot of traveling like that, and so DH’s first plane flight was for work after college.

    DS’s K-8 private school had the February Ski Week break that Finn described. His public high school doesn’t.

  93. In San Diego, we were the destination for many friends and relatives. One year I remember going to Disneyland 5 times with different east coast visitors.

    In many immigrant families, you end up playing host if you live in a popular tourist area. If you live in the NYC and it’s metro area, San Francisco, Chicago etc. you are sure to get visitors. Some people you know real well and some you don’t but host because they are known to your relatives and friends.
    One lady used to make the trip from Akron to the Niagara Falls, with visitors on a regular basis.

  94. If you are looking for something interesting to watch, I recommend Delhi Crime on Netflix. It won the International Emmy Award for the best drama series.
    The presentation and acting is very good. It has subtitles but lots of English words sprinkled throughout.

  95. I enjoyed reading your travel stories. It was a way to discuss travel without focusing too much on what we can’t do right now.

    I received an email from one of my health care providers that they “expect to begin offering COVID-19 vaccines to our patients in early 2021”. It’s getting real. Have you all received similar communication? I think I could realistically be eligible for vaccination in the first quarter of 2021. When I saw my cardiologist earlier this month he said for my next check up in 6 months it’s likely we’ll both be vaccinated.

  96. In many immigrant families, you end up playing host if you live in a popular tourist area.

    This was going to be our experience. We had so many friends and family scheduled to visit us (my parents were set to arrive the day we went into the first lockdown) that we would have used many vacation days taking them around the city. This goes back to my “looking for silver linings” on the other thread. We were looking forward to showing them our favorite parts of the city, but instead we were able to use our days off to explore other parts of the country. Right now it’s the holidays and I miss friends & family so I wish we could have seen them. But I think my future self will be glad we didn’t have to continually schlep up to the top of the Eiffel Tower every 6 weeks.

  97. I’ve enjoyed this thread too. An email I got from a travel site gives me another idea for “a way to discuss travel without focusing too much on what we can’t do right now.” Anybody want to tell funny stories about past travel gone wrong?

    Thanks to the person (Austin?) who mentioned having their kids get life insurance, etc before doing 23 & me!

  98. Kim — I haven’t received any communications from my health care providers regarding vaccination. Under the general MA guidelines, though, it looks like DH will be in the second phase (out of three) of vaccination (anticipated to take place February-April) since he’s a teacher. Grocery workers are also in the Massachusetts Phase Two, but I’m not sure if DS will qualify, because (1) he is part-time, and (2) he is under 18. DD and I apparently will be in Phase 3, the final one.

  99. But I think my future self will be glad we didn’t have to continually schlep up to the top of the Eiffel Tower every 6 weeks.

    Maybe it’s just how my family works, but if we went to visit you, we wouldn’t expect you to play tour guide and take us to places you’ve been to 15 times. Of course we’d spend time with you, but we’d do the big touristy stuff on our own. Although we’d hope you could show us the neat out-of-the-way and off-the-beaten-path stuff you’ve found.

  100. On the vaccine, as I posted previously, one of my AL facilities is working on having me included when their staff and residents get it. I haven’t heard anything at all from my own providers.

  101. J-M, last night I was watching House Hunters International. I assume they were filmed in 2019 and the whole time I’m thinking, you’ll want that balcony during lockdown, and no one will be visiting so don’t worry about a second bedroom.

    I have a few friends that got vaccinated this week, and some family in my bubble are scheduled for just after Christmas. yay!

  102. I think an advantage of knowing people in big, touristy places is that they know the “off-the-beaten-path” spots. Of course, there might be a limit to what’s interesting there too. I remember that when a friend of my parents who had slipped out of East Germany in the late 40s asked me for an itinerary in Berlin in the 90s, a travel magazine published ice skater Katerina Witt’s recommendations just a couple months later, and they were the same as mine.

    J-M, what do you think of the garden at the Cluny Museum? I think there’s a rooftop restaurant too.

  103. I emailed my NP and she said they’d start sending out notifications in April or May. I’m not in any of the first-round categories. I’m probably not even in any of the second-round categories. I’d love to get it sooner but I can wait my turn.

  104. NoB. I am in Mass i am in phase 2 but the very back end, after the teachers and essential workers. DH is at the front end of phase 2. I will ask when I schedule his if being his caregiver conveys anything, but no expectation of that. I think the bridge clubs will require proof of vaccination to attend when they reopen.

  105. The last time I checked, on one of those online calculators, I’m in line behind about 230 million people. I imagine I’ll get the virus long before I get the vaccine.


    I am listening to a webinar this afternoon from our corporate attorneys re when employers can require vaccines. Me? I see no trampling of my rights if my employer, bridge club, restaurant, shops, etc. say after the vaccines are widely available to whatever the lowest priority groups are ‘ya gotta have proof of vaccine to come in.’

  107. No short, no shoes, no mask, no vax no service.

    I have no problems with that, nor do I see anyone’s rights being trampled, but I expect it will be challenged by people who oppose masks on religious grounds. I think the same of that as I do of people who oppose the MMR vaccination or who insist on their right to have venomous snakes handed around during church services.

  108. “oppose masks on religious grounds” Is that a thing?

    Required vaccinations for employment is a hot topic in my line of work. Initial consensus is that it can be mandatory and that safety of workplace trumps individual worker’s rights. If reasonable accommodations can not be made for those that can’t get vaccinated, then the employee can be let go. Nothing is clear, and I’m sure those in employment law will be busy. :)

  109. for those that can’t get vaccinated,

    In the case of those who just don’t want to get vaccinated they don’t have any rights, do they? It’s at will employment – they can fire you for any reason or no reason at all.

  110. S&M, Cluny is one of my most favorite museums on the planet. However, I don’t really recall the garden. I’ll have to look at my photos from the most recent trip. The building is beautiful and of course the art work is amazing.

  111. How can employers require vaccinations for people at the back of the line? They can’t demand that the employee magically get a better spot in line.
    I am at the back, and just hope that I can get vaccinated before next fall semester

  112. How can employers require vaccinations for people at the back of the line?

    They can’t. It’s when the vaccine is available and people choose not to be vaccinated.

  113. “I have designated myself as the tail end of the herd.”

    That’s a good one. I’m right there with Cass — by the time a vaccine is made available to DH and me, we will probably have gotten the virus (if we haven’t already had it). Fortunately, there are millions of Americans ahead of us in the queue and if there are any serious problems or it turns out not be as effective in the larger population as it was in the first stage clinical trials, it will be easier to make an informed decision. My dad is closer to the front of the line, but as he’s not even in an ALF he will have to wait until 2021, which is fine with both of us because we don’t know much about how the first two EUA vaccines will work in those over 85.

    Employers, schools, and universities may require proof of vaccine, and airlines could easily impose that requirement (once the FDA actually approves them), but it is hard to imagine how restaurants, retail, mass transit systems and other venues open to the public could do the same.

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