Retirement conflicts

by L

What will you do if in retirement, your spouse wants to retire to one place but you prefer another?

What to Do When He Wants to Retire One Place, She Another

Luckily, neither DH nor I would prefer to retire to a warmer climate!

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114 thoughts on “Retirement conflicts

  1. We have a running joke about how much nicer Naples gets the older we get. The one issue I’ve noticed is it’s very hard to find a one bedroom unit. I understand that most retirees want enough room for the kids/grandkids. But how often are the kids going to visit? Not more than 2 weeks a year total. At that point, it would cheaper and easier to just put them up at a hotel vs. having a home that’s 3x too big 95% of the time.

  2. We’ll probably get there eventually — DH and I are generally aligned in what we want to do for the first 5-10 years, but I am sure that eventually I will want to be near grandkids, and he’ll probably care more about the location (skiing, big city activities, etc.). Our current plan is the “two residences” thing, but I imagine even that will get difficult after a while. So IDK. Then again, if we’re both still around by that point, it seems likely that the fact that we can’t maintain two residences any more would tip the balance in favor of relocating near grandkids, so it is easier for the kid to help out.

    More generally, I assume we will manage this decision the same way we have managed all of the others: the person who cares less defers to the person who cares more, and then we make sure that we both get enough of what we care more about. Which, of course, means that by the time the grandkids come along, I win. ;-)

  3. Sometimes. But even if they’re not, it’s nicer for everyone if they have their own space to escape to when possible.

  4. I was recently thinking for the younger period of retirement, a couple of month-long VRBO rentals in various places would be really fun and low-commitment.

  5. We are already in our retirement location. However, I want to move out of our house to a one level home. I love our neighborhood and would like to move to a ranch home in our neighborhood. I hope all the ranches are not torn down for two level homes by then.
    I would love a beach condo but I also would like to travel more and I don’t know whether I would want to maintain a second home or use the money to travel.
    This is a good enough place for the kids to settle eventually or even right after their education is complete.

  6. Given 3 kids to put through college, and the youngest only 11, we are a long ways off from retirement! I can’t imagine why I would want to leave here, though, unless it gets physically untenable, or if a set of grandkids should pop up in a fun location.
    My MIL, who is 95, is still living in the house where she raised her kids.

  7. Rhett – I wouldn’t want to be dependent on that when there are so many better options.

    DW’s relatives a few years ago were living in the five-story luxury waterfront townhouse, and talking about how the elevator would allow them to “age in place.” That sounds great to a lot of people when aging is some distant concept.

    Then they had an unexpected couple of relocations alongside an MS diagnosis, and when they came back to the area, single-level or main-floor MBR was the key requirement.

  8. BTW, is anyone watching “Ozark?” Our cabin didn’t have cable, so we finished House of Cards and followed Netflix’s suggestion for their new series. We’re enjoying it immensely.

  9. “But how often are the kids going to visit? Not more than 2 weeks a year total.”

    I recall hearing that it’s not uncommon for condo buildings to have units available to rent for visiting family.

    Also, on a recent remodeling show I saw one retiree couple choose a water-side home with a master bedroom and one other dorm-style bedroom that could sleep about 8-10 guests. That sounded interesting.

  10. Rhett – I wouldn’t want to be dependent on that when there are so many better options.

    Do you mean another vendor or moving or an elevator, etc?

  11. I like Milo’s idea of month long VRBOs in different locations. We haven’t given serious thought to our retirement activities yet. DH has mentioned cooking school, which I like.

  12. “I was recently thinking for the younger period of retirement, a couple of month-long VRBO rentals in various places would be really fun and low-commitment.”

    An early retiree couple I know did this for the first 5ish years of retirement, to try out different places and see which they liked the best. Eventually, they bought a place in Arizona and now snowbird there. I like this idea too, but we’ll see. If you really want to go to a warmer climate for 4-6 months a year, buying your own place has some appeal both on comfort and $$, depending.

  13. “Do you mean another vendor or moving or an elevator, etc?”

    I wouldn’t want to depend on an elevator or a lift just to get around my house. I’d rather live on one level at that point. (An elevator to get to and from the place would be fine.)

  14. Our tentative plan is the month-long VRBO rental idea. Both of us agree that we’d like shorter winters, so I could see spending January and February in warmer locations, including in the US and elsewhere. Owning two homes is not appealing for a number of reasons.

    I also have recently thought of the idea of spending extended time visiting with relatives, perhaps VRBO rentals close to each other.

  15. LfB, what if the kids live in different areas – how will you decide which grandchildren to live near?

  16. With DD#1 entering senior year and DD#2 sophomore year of high school, we are at least 7 years out from making a decision on changing residences. We bought our floor plan because the master, living, dining, kitchen, breakfast room and laundry are all on the ground floor. A second living area and 3 bedrooms are upstairs. Other than changing the AC/Heating filter, we can live without ever going upstairs. Our house is paid off and we are at the point (been here 14 years) of replacing carpet/flooring and doing some updates to paint/wall paper, etc. The changes we are making have an eye toward aging in place.

    Until both DDs are grown and flown, we have no reason to change locations though as they leave the upstairs rooms will likely shift in their make up. We have considered some remodels to the upstairs to make it easier to have a live-in care giver, such as adding a “wet bar” or more likely a “dry bar” area to give the person upstairs access to a small fridge and microwave without having to come to the main kitchen. With the current house set up, addting the “wet” component might be cost prohibitive.

    But, 10 years from now he will be almost 80 and we will need to be thinking about that next phase of life, especially if his health follows that of his parents.

  17. I think the second bedroom is important for family visitors, and future help. My mom’s friend just got very sick two weeks ago. Some fungus in his toe that turned into a huge infection. He can barely walk, so he couldn’t go home. Three steps to get into his house and bedroom upstairs. Only 70.
    He was fine just a month ago. Owns his own business, swims and play tennis and now he won’t be able to walk for at least another week.

    I keep seeing this over, and over again with my parents friends. They are fine one day, and suddenly they need help or they can’t get up any stairs.

    My BIL can’t visit us or my inlaws because neither of us has a bathroom in our homes that doesn’t require several steps. He is in a wheelchair from MS.

    So, our choices have narrowed as we see what’s happening to our family and friends that are 10,20, 30 years older.

    We hope to stay around here, but in a full service apartment building with an elevator. If my dream comes true, then we might move back to the city. We hope to rent for a few months a year in Florida to avoid the winter in the north.

    We’re open to the idea of moving if DD moves to another part of the country and wants us to be closer to her.

  18. One possible conflict we have is that DH likes being near the ocean so the Carolinas and Florida appeal to him. I like desert climate so the southwest appeals to me. But if we rent a month at a time we could do both.

  19. I want to stay in our house and our town for as long as possible. DH does, too. In retirement, I would look forward to having more time to enjoy all the wonderful things that are around here. A short trip away now and then for fun would be nice, but I have no desire to spend retirement going away for weeks or months at a time.

  20. The downside to renting a month at a time is that you’re just visitors in these places. That’s why I was thinking of having a home base, let’s say, oh, I don’t know, here:

    and then maybe a month away in August, and a month away in February.

  21. Rhett – We won’t need so much space with the kids gone and I would like to sort of start over with a different house. I like my neighborhood and neighbors better than I like my particular house. Unless something drastic happens the families here appear to be settled in for the long term, so we have long term neighbors rather than somewhere we don’t know anyone.

  22. Given that retirement for most is at 65, and trends are going to push it to 67 or more, I don’t see more than 5 to 10 years before health and mobility start being issues. I guess I have never understood relocating to places far from family so late in life. Better to stay near family and friends, and travel instead, while you still can

  23. Lauren is 1000% correct. It seems that over age 75, heath issues take you from independent one day to, temporarily or permanently, unable to manage in your own home, even for people who have been in “good health” until then.

    Having help that has some specific tasks to do when they are there, but are otherwise “on call” as needed, it can be helpful for them to have a room to be in so they don’t feel in the way, especially when other guests are there.

  24. “We hope to stay around here, but in a full service apartment building with an elevator. ”

    I see a lot of retirees in my building. It’s an interesting mix of retirees and younger couples with kids.

  25. Are you guys planning to have live in home health aides??? From watching friends with parents with serious health problems and dementia, it seems that simply cobbling together help for a few hours a day is hard enough.

  26. “Are you guys planning to have live in home health aides??? ”

    Possibly. Why the triple question marks?

  27. If you need that level of care, you’re probably not spending money on too many other things.

    At that point, I’ll probably just want some help to go on a late-afternoon boat ride, and then it’s mainly Netflix and FOX News.

  28. Given that retirement for most is at 65, and trends are going to push it to 67 or more,

    I don’t know about that. 42% of men at 48% of women claim SS at 62. Do you think if you husband got laid off at 58 that he’ll land another job? Your situation is obviously different.

  29. “I guess I have never understood relocating to places far from family so late in life. Better to stay near family and friends, and travel instead, while you still can”

    I agree! My goal is to move closer to extended family and try and subtly influence my kids to move there, so we can all be together. Not a big stretch, as there are a ton of neat companies there, and the boys enjoy hanging out with the extended family. (Chose a visit with family over a ski vacation or cruise for Spring Break.)

  30. Sometimes an older person needs temporary but essentially full time assistance, to recover from surgery or during intensive cancer treatment. So having a second bedroom available is good.
    It is unusual, however, for “friends and family” to be permanent fixtures in an area. People do move, especially when they retire or switch to a remote work situation, or get divorced or lose a spouse. If you decide to age in place to stay near family and friends, you may watch them relocate

  31. We are also planning on the VRBO/AirBnB month-at-a-time thing, largely for our travels for the first 5-10 years. We will definitely keep our home base here (or, you know, happy to trade it for Milo’s home base, wow!), but I like the idea of traveling for a longer period and renting an apartment or house somewhere for a month or so — there’s something different, more relaxing about feeling like you are part of the neighborhood.

    @DD: Good question — figure we’ll answer that when we get there. Practically speaking, we are planning on keeping this house as home base, and there are enough jobs in the area that there is a reasonable chance that at least one of the kids will wind up back around here. So if we have an option that does not require a total uprooting — e.g., sell the big house and move into a condo but in the same general area — that is probably the default choice. If neither is here, maybe choose the one with the best weather or amenities.

    But if all else is equal, I’m moving closer to DS. Because DD is way, WAY too much like my mother and would drive me batshit crazy telling me what to do and how I need to take care of myself, etc. :-)

  32. We are trying to figure out where to move now so I can’t think about where I’ll be in retirement. Cape Cod will probably be home base and could also see spending some time in Amelia Island, FL

  33. My neighbor is a single woman in her 50/60s who had to have a health care aide tend to her after she badly injured her knee. Her parents (elderly themselves) stop by to check in on her. My neighbor luckily has a coveted (by me) ranch house.
    I see having a health care aide in situations such as this, when there is immobility for a time, followed by physical therapy but ultimate recovery.

  34. For awhile, we’ll go back and forth between Denver and California. That will happen more often when DH actually finally retires and the cat crosses the rainbow bridge. But when we start to become disabled, then I don’t know. I’d rather be in California since there isn’t any ice on the sidewalks. But I just don’t know what will happen. DSS keeps muttering about maybe trying his hand at a Silicon Valley startup job and I keep hopping up and down and yelling “Yes! Do it!” because then we wouldn’t have to go to the East Coast to see the grandkids and DH would be a lot more likely to settle in California.

    There are so many great things about Denver, too, though. Except for the ice.

  35. One of my co-workers had a stair elevator. It worked fine.

    It does always remind me of the old TV show The Farmer’s Daughter, though.

  36. First of all, for most of you at your current life stage the question is not where to retire, but when. That can be a huge area of dispute, especially for those couples in which one took a kid hiatus early rather than as the kids hit double digit in age or a move to the suburbs. I d like to have a 100K for every conversation I have with a prosperous supportive educated wife who had big ramp up work or even serious volunteer plans as the kids go to college and now, well, Jerry wants me to stay free for travel and he has no idea when he’s going to ease up or retire. So I’ll remodel the house. Or other spouse wants to die with boots on. We have plenty of money and want to travel etc. and I want to do this while still vigorous.

  37. We have every expectation that a stair elevator will do for any mobility issue short of complete wheelchair. A set of CA grandkids would lead to a small rental apt or long stay vrbos. We aren’t moving away from Boston as long as DH is alive. I reserve my right to do anything I choose at any time.

  38. I have no idea when we will retire. I think it will be more a factor of our job situations than anything else.

  39. I would like to avoid the moving 4x during retirement that my grandparents did if at all possible (they moved at roughly age 61, 72, 74, and 80 – and then stayed in the last place for 10+ years!). DH loves this place so will probably want to stay here for 30 years until we are around 70. Then after that hopefully we can move to a nice tower in the sky and have our robot home health aide and our self-driving car take care of most of our needs until we need to go to the home. :)

  40. Mémé, your comment gives me hope that I can ramp up in my 50’s. Mr WCE wants to retire and dedicate himself to hunting, fishing, woodworking and old computers, all of which I have limited interest in. Maybe I can get a 9 month position at the university and have summers off…

  41. Yeah, our current plan is 7 years, when DS goes off to college (by which time DD should be out of undergrad and we will know what the remaining financial commitment is for DS). But of course that depends on how the market goes, maintaining our current jobs, etc.. DH thinks it may be 10-11 years, but that is based on a retirement budget that I consider to be pretty ridiculous. I think the bigger issue is going to be pulling him away from the excitement of the tech, since that’s not something we can replicate at home without, oh, a spare billion or so.

    Of course, I also reserve the right to say screw it at any time and do something stupid like move abroad just because. Not that I actually will, but I like to think I can. ;-)

  42. I see having a health care aide in situations such as this, when there is immobility for a time, followed by physical therapy but ultimate recovery.

    I see adds for these types of services. I assume it’s possible to have an agreement with them in place before you need them? Give our collective resources, it seems a little presumptuous to expect a 40 year old adult child with 3 kids and a job to drop everything because we tore our ACL in some freak yoga accident. Or even worse falling off a ladder taking down the Christmas lights when we’re 87.

  43. ““We hope to stay around here, but in a full service apartment building with an elevator. ””

    This is what I would like to do. I would also like to be closer to the lakefront. Ideally – our next move would be to an elevator building w a doorman and then eventually have another place somewhere warm.

    To me, part of the appeal of having a full-on second home and being a snowbird is having community in both places vs. being just a visitor.

    Hopefully, things will work out that we will be able to retire in our 50’s and have many years of active retirement. That’s the plan we’ve been actively working toward for the past few years, but obviously a lot can change in 10-15 years. We’ll see.

  44. I just came home from spending a few days touring retirement communities with my parents. My mom is almost 80, social and in good physical condition. My dad is 86, has health issues and is no longer very social. My mother hovers over him constantly, so now there are many things that he used to do for himself that he can no longer do. My mom has her sights set on a large well-regarded CCRC (continuous care retirement community) with lots of outings, exercise classes, pools, restaurants, assisted living, dementia care, etc. They’d never have to move again. Dad is leaning towards a much smaller place that is only an independent living facility, with no other services on site. It would be a real problem if anything ever happened to my mother because he cannot live on his own. He doesn’t like being left alone, and I suspect he wants to go to a place where there is less to do so that my mother will be around more. She currently takes yoga classes, does tai chi, plays mah jong, you name it, and he counts the minutes until she returns. So right now they are debating where to go, and I suspect that they’ll wind up at the smaller place with few services when a unit becomes available.

    One of the residents at the CCRC mentioned that they should move in while they’re healthy enough to enjoy all the activities and offerings. Don’t wait until your afflictions prevent you from participating and making friends. Very true. Also, the better places having fairly long waiting lists, depending on the location and the particular type of unit (cottage or apartment).

    DH and I aren’t sure where we’ll end up retiring. I really like our town but it’s expensive to live there. DH doesn’t like the heat, so I doubt we’ll move too far south.

  45. Rhett – Based on my experiences when my mother was alive, you don’t need to have an agreement with a home-care agency before you need them. If a need arises, you can just call them up, tell them that you (or someone you’re responsible for) needs assistance, and then they’ll get a caregiver out. They can generally do it on quick notice. They can provide anything from a couple of hours a day to 24/7 coverage.

    The agencies aren’t cheap; I was paying $24 per hour, and that was roughly five years ago. But hiring through an agency is much easier than trying to hire on your own; you don’t have to deal with any issues of being an employer.

  46. Rhett said “it seems a little presumptuous to expect a 40 year old adult child with 3 kids and a job to drop everything because we tore our ACL in some freak yoga accident. Or even worse falling off a ladder taking down the Christmas lights when we’re 87.”

    It seems presumptuous, but it is very much what I see happening. I know a fair number of women in the sandwich years who are juggling this kind of thing. It is very, very, very stressful. I have one friend who lives in CA, and whose sister lives in South America, with an elderly widowed mom. My friend asked her mom to move to CA with them, but instead the mom moved down South. She has no friends in the area, and seems to have a health crisis several times a year, meaning my friend and her sister have to drop everything and fly long distances. It is a mess. Other friends have dealt with dementia, or parents going in and out of the hospital, or temporary mobility problems. Yes, they get home health aides, but it is expensive and usually the aides come in for 4 or 8 hours only. And they get sick and have no replacement or they show up late or they don’t do the things they are supposed to do, so the adult child has to take on a lot of supervision. When I see this, I thank my lucky stars that I was never in this position with my parents or ILs.

  47. My friend asked her mom to move to CA with them, but instead the mom moved down South. She has no friends in the area, and seems to have a health crisis several times a year, meaning my friend and her sister have to drop everything and fly long distances.

    I hope we’d never do something so selfish.

  48. Some childcare agencies, like Bright Horizons, also offer in-home care for the elderly. I wonder what level of care?

  49. But what if you totally fell in love with that little place in Naples, but your kids have moved to Vancouver?

  50. We don’t have any plans to move from our city, although that could change depending on the kids. I could see getting a condo downtown at some point and eliminate yard work and other maintenance.

    Maybe we’ll move sooner as my next door neighbor is driving me crazy. We installed a new cedar fence last year. We are getting it stained today, but she won’t let us stain the side facing her yard because she doesn’t approve of the stain color. In the grand scheme of things that could go wrong with neighbors, she is on the minor end of things compared to violence or drugs, but I still can’t stand her. I doubt she’ll ever move, so I’ll spend the next 20-30 years never speaking to her!

  51. I worked at a previous job with a woman who was in her early 60’s who was dealing with an elderly mom with dementia. She lived with the mom, which is not uncommon in this area, especially among the more traditional Italian-American families. They had 2 aides that came in for different 4 hour shifts, so 8 hours a day of coverage. The poor woman was constantly late for work because an aide didn’t show, and she spent a lot of time on the phone because there was always turnover and the new aide wouldn’t know how to do things, and then she had to leave right at 5:30 because she had to get home so the aide could leave.

  52. I think we will stay around here, but who knows. One thing I would really like to do is make sure that we are in a place that is easy to get to. Getting to my parents home takes a whole day which really limits how much we can see them. I always say “oh if they just lived in Chicago, we could come for a long weekend.” THey don’t travel anymore so if we are going to see them, we are going, so I keep that in mind as we move forward.

  53. We are getting it stained today, but she won’t let us stain the side facing her yard because she doesn’t approve of the stain color

    Too bad you can’t detach the panels and paint her side dayglow orange then reinstall.

  54. Kerri – yes, the fence and retaining wall we put in are right on the property line, so the painters need to go into her yard to stain. They are still going into her yard though to move tarps to prevent the overspray getting on her stuff. I guess it doesn’t really matter as I don’t have to see that side of the fence, but the way she handled it is very annoying. But now I don’t feel guilty for not liking her :)

  55. “But what if you totally fell in love with that little place in Naples, but your kids have moved to Vancouver?”

    I could see where either or both parties could be considered selfish. If the parent keeps having emergencies that require the child to travel that’s a problem. But OTOH the parent may have made many sacrifices for the child throughout the years so if the parent wants to live in a warm climate during some of her last years maybe the child can help accommodate that wish. It’s hard to judge from the outside.

    Has anyone here had a good experience with a geriatric care manager?

  56. Rhett – I asked the painters if they would paint as far down her side of the fence from our side of the yard, but they refused. I would pay them extra to do that, but I get that it isn’t good business for them. The painters were laughing at me though because I told them I just came from a meeting at church and then was dropping massive F-bombs. I’ve been stabby all morning, but I’m starting to calm down a little bit.

  57. But what if you totally fell in love with that little place in Naples, but your kids have moved to Vancouver?

    Then charter a jet when the time comes. (IIRC that was the ideal solution for Fred’s FIL but he was too cheap and would rather inconvenience everyone else.) Or, move into assisted living early. And/or arrange for in home care. From what I’ve seen these issues are a lot to deal with if you don’t have money. If you have money, it’s not really a problem.

  58. tcmama — I wonder if your neighbor resents you for having the fence to begin with. I’ve seen that in some neighborhoods fences are considered neighborly. Personally I love fences and we are one of the few yards in our neighborhood that has a tallish privacy fence.

  59. Rhett said “If you have money, it’s not really a problem.”

    Yeah, I guess I don’t know a lot of people with elderly parents who have the kind of resources you are assuming. Many of my friends are from modest backgrounds, and only recently have pulled themselves into the dreaded UMC. Their parents didn’t accumulate much. My friends mom who moved South had been a teacher all her life, widowed young so she had been the sole support. Her choice of moving down there had a lot to do with cost of living.

  60. “One of the residents at the CCRC mentioned that they should move in while they’re healthy enough to enjoy all the activities and offerings. Don’t wait until your afflictions prevent you from participating and making friends.”

    This is very true. Also, IMO it is a mistake to choose a community that lacks at least assisted living services, because even very healthy people who are 80+ can turn unhealthy in a heartbeat and really need help. Independent-only units are great for 60-year olds, but can be a disaster for older folks, because it can be very difficult to find a spot in an assisted living place on demand. Then you end up having to settle for the place that has a room RIGHT NOW. Ginger, I hope that you can persuade your mom to insist on the larger place. Your dad will be cranky no matter where they go, but at least your mom will be happier there.

  61. When we moved to this house it had a privacy fence, and when we replaced it a few years ago the contractor offered us a style with slats placed so there was some visibility between yards. He gave us some insight on fence etiquette and preferences.

  62. Both inlaws and my own parents never were in charge for caring for their so they don’t know what the process entails. My inlaws have seen the health care aide come for my neighbor so they have gotten used to the idea.
    I say this because although they know that health care aides will be in the picture they deep down expect family to do hands on care.
    There was help in the home country but it was never acknowledged – it felt better to say your family was personally taking care of you.

  63. “Some childcare agencies, like Bright Horizons, also offer in-home care for the elderly. I wonder what level of care?”

    I wonder too. We have subsidized backup care as a benefit at work, and it includes eldercare. I haven’t had cause to use it yet though. (just childcare)

  64. There was help in the home country but it was never acknowledged – it felt better to say your family was personally taking care of you.

    Don’t most people middle class and above have servants anyway?

  65. “Has anyone here had a good experience with a geriatric care manager?”

    We did. I remembered that Meme had posted about them, and got one for DH’s family when MIL had a sudden health crisis and could not live at home alone. One of the best things about the GCM was that she could provide objective help — for example, a team came to the house to evaluate it after MIL was ready to live the assisted living/rehab place. They pointed out obvious (to me) stuff, such as lack of handrails, dangerous scatter rugs, etc. in a professional, businesslike way that BIL could accept, rather than the bossy, frustrated way that DH or I would have been. They lined up 24/7 care at home for the first month, with caregivers that they had personally vetted.

    They also could have helped the family recognize that MIL really needed to be living somewhere other than in her house — if the family had agreed to keep paying for their services, but, alas, they didn’t. Now BIL has realized that MIL at home is a disaster waiting to happen, but because he failed to get the applications in to assisted living/memory care facilities last year, they are now on a long wait list.

  66. “Ginger, I hope that you can persuade your mom to insist on the larger place. Your dad will be cranky no matter where they go, but at least your mom will be happier there.”

    I agree. It seems like a better long-term choice for a variety of reasons. I also agree that moving to a CCRC while still fairly active is a good idea. My grandmother resisted it a bit, but once she moved, she said she wished she had ditched the house 5 years earlier. She moved in when she was in her mid-70’s, and was healthy/active into her 90’s. She did spend her last year in assisted living with some stints in the nursing wing.

  67. Since Rhett brought up my FIL I thought I’d just say that 4.5 mos after he broke his leg he was cleared to fly home commercial (i.e. not on the “medical ambulance”). Nonstop 4.5 hr flight, first class. I think for everyone concerned, including his 3 daughters who all had their summers turned upside down and 3 of his grandkids who went there to help my MIL deal with all this or to fly back with them (cleared to fly does not mean ‘is fully self sufficient’), having him just stay out there until he was healthy enough vs coming home mid-recovery/recuperation was for the best.

    On the topic of the medical ambulance vs just chartering a private jet, the jet option was only about 20% less costly than the ambulance option.

    Now he is/they are at the family’s 3-story beach home which includes an interior elevator (built that way in 1998). He has to deal with up to 2 steps at a time, and I guess he is. I’ll know much more about his real condition since we’re going to be with them next week.

  68. “Ginger, I hope that you can persuade your mom to insist on the larger place. Your dad will be cranky no matter where they go, but at least your mom will be happier there.”

    +1.

  69. If anyone wants to talk about The Mooch getting fired on his 10th day. You know where to go.

  70. Yeah, I guess I don’t know a lot of people with elderly parents who have the kind of resources you are assuming.

    I would add that even having modest amount (by totebag standards) of retirements assets and income can go a long way toward mitigating a lot of these issues. Less than $2 million and a house will get most of us 95% of the way there. A lot of the folks having problems are more the modest home and maybe a few $100k in retirement and SS.

  71. “I would add that even having modest amount (by totebag standards) of retirements assets and income can go a long way toward mitigating a lot of these issues. Less than $2 million and a house will get most of us 95% of the way there. A lot of the folks having problems are more the modest home and maybe a few $100k in retirement and SS.”

    ITA. Also – pensions. Lots of pensions among the MC/UMC snowbird crowd.

  72. “Ginger, I hope that you can persuade your mom to insist on the larger place. Your dad will be cranky no matter where they go, but at least your mom will be happier there.”

    I’m working on it. Today when I spoke to her she said they’re leaning towards the small place. Both places have waiting lists but I’m hoping that the larger facility will have an opening sooner, and that will incentivize them to move and just get it over with. They’re really anxious to get out of their house.

    I’ll keep you posted.

  73. DH and I want the same things in retirement, but close friends of ours are so far apart in what they want it’s hilarious. He’d like to camp for a year in various South American countries, possibly teaching, then live in a very rustic cabin in some remote place. She’d like to be in Manhattan. We shall see how that works out!

  74. “DH likes being near the ocean so the Carolinas and Florida appeal to him. I like desert climate so the southwest appeals to me.”

    How about someplace near Carlsbad or Escondido, CA? Or Kona?

  75. “With the current house set up, addting the “wet” component might be cost prohibitive.”

    It might also violate zoning rules. The wet component might be viewed as making it a second kitchen, which are often not allowed in areas zoned for single-family homes.

  76. “The downside to renting a month at a time is that you’re just visitors in these places.”

    One reason I liked the idea of spending a month, or perhaps a bit longer (e.g., a ski season) in one place like this was the chance to experience it at a much different level than just a few days in a hotel, and having a chance to be less of a visitor.

    I suppose it actually would put us somewhere in between.

    Locally, one upside is that renting for a month or longer opens up a lot more legal options. Rentals of a month or more are not considered short-term, and not subject to the often flouted laws applying to them.

  77. I see frail looking seniors at the grocery store, shopping slowly. Some single older ladies are accompanied by an aide. I see seniors at church too. I admire their resilience. I don’t know whether I would have the grit to get out of bed and make my way slowly up and about.
    I hope I have inherited the right genes not only where physical health but also in the mental health area as I age.

  78. http://www.aplaceformom.com/senior-care-resources/articles/elder-care-costs

    Live in care doesn’t have to be as expensive as you think. 5 years ago in California, the in-laws were paying $140/day for a live-in provider through a legal agency. I don’t quite understand how that works with minimum wage, but I wasn’t in charge and no one wanted my opinion. The above chart states that it can be as low as $112 per day, compared with $200 for a nursing home. So, this is not just an activity for the very rich – it is cost saving compared to other options.

    These were not caregivers on 8 hour shifts – they came for 24 hours, slept in the spare bedroom at night and handed off to the next caregiver at the end of the shift. It was imperfect, but it kept everyone at home, which was more the goal than anything else. They did personal care, grocery shopping, cooking and cleaning. FIL now pays someone (privately, and probably under the table), $700 a week for thoses services, plus room and board. Also, imperfect, but again, no one asking for my advice of the situation. These types of caregivers are often cheaper than 4 hours here and there of visiting nurse.

    Even if you don’t ever have a live in caregiver, do y’all really want to live in a 1 bedroom place with a spouse? I love the DH and hope to grow very old together. With a minimum of two bedrooms. We’ve never lived smaller than that. Certainly we could figure out how to live in our motorhome or whatever, but before I use my hard-earned money to charter jets and such, I will be spending it on a 2 bedroom condo.

  79. Agree with Ada on all points.

    “He’d like to camp for a year in various South American countries, possibly teaching, then live in a very rustic cabin in some remote place. She’d like to be in Manhattan. We shall see how that works out!”

    Do both. Separate for six months or a year. Then maintain a small NYC condo and a cabin in the ADirondacks.

    DW and I did six months apart as newlyweds. Surely a couple married for 30 years can take that break apart.

  80. y’all really want to live in a 1 bedroom place with a spouse

    I’ve been promised it’s all go-go-go and not siting around watching Matlock. You’ll only be home to sleep….or so they say.

  81. @Ada – Yes, I agree. I know we live in a smaller space than most now, but even as a couple with DS out of the house, I picture preferring 2BR/2BA for a very long time. A 1BR plus den with 2BA would be okay too I think.

  82. “How about someplace near Carlsbad or Escondido, CA? Or Kona?”

    I hadn’t thought of CA or HI, but those might be good ideas.

  83. Also, my opinion influenced by the fact that I am currently in a 500sqft apartment with 4 other people.

  84. Milo – in fact, he’s mostly retired now (they’ve already been together for 30 years) and they’re doing just that. He takes off for kayaking/camping trips, goes sailing or hiking, etc while she stays home and works. Seems like a good way to do things.

  85. L – I feel you could bring live-in help to L’Abbey and then a number of us could move in. Totebag cocktail parties complete with walkwrs and hearing aids.

  86. Risley, but we’d need a separate politics room. One big screen tv tuned to Fox News, another one tuned to MSNBC, and soundproofing on the walls and door separating that room from the rest of L’Abbey.

  87. ” people to type for us …”

    Voice recognition, to instantaneously convert spoken dialog to written, for the hard of hearing.

    This reminds me of my auntie, whose hearing degraded considerably when she got old. One of her biggest frustrations was how difficult this made chatting on the phone with friends. She would have benefited greatly from such technology, as well as from email and texting.

  88. Imagine pulling into KOA in that.

    I’d happily settle for something more like the Madden Cruiser.

  89. Milo,

    Due to the owner’s major change in plans,…The layout has put priority on reducing the need to climb steps. I assume it’s being sold due to a health crisis.

  90. Probably.

    The other boat I almost posted was this one:

    http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/2016/Krogen-58%27-Extended-Bridge-3087661/Annapolis/MD/United-States

    Only due to a tremendous career opportunity, have the owners of Bulldog decided to offer this extraordinary yacht for sale now and then again build new at a later date.

    You can see the crux of Meme’s comment playing out in the sales listings of multi-million dollar trawler yachts. “One more business opportunity” vs. “it’s too late.”

    If you’re curious for an easy visual example of why these two brands have a steep price premium over the competition that’s the same size (and much faster and more powerful) take a look at the sixth photo of the galley kitchen and note the strength and fittings of the door that leads outside.

  91. The Krogen is 58′, not 75′.

    But getting at their key differences, the Krogen has twin 160 hp diesel inboards. That’s tiny. That’s two of my pontoon boat’s engines on a 50-ton boat. By contrast, the Sunseeker has twin 1,550 hp diesel pods. Still, the Krogen weighs roughly the same as the Sunseeker that is almost 20′ longer.

    The Krogen is a slow tank with a 7,000 lb ballast just in its keel and a top speed of just 10 knots. The Sunseeker is a giant speed boat that will max out at 34 knots (39 mph).

  92. “these very nice boats are hardly used !”

    Well, they are pretty new. Still, very light use is typical for boats and RVs. And it’s not always a good thing for the buyer, because it can equal neglect and deferred maintenance. To the contrary, many (in a much smaller category) will include in their listings “Just completed the Great Loop, ready to go again!”

  93. Risley and HM – we have several extra rooms and an extra building, although DH wouldn’t take kindly to his office being overrun by Fox News – those people might have to go in the shed in the yard. ;) I think we would also have to put in the stair climbing unit, or maybe an elevator on the far side of the building.

  94. “but close friends of ours are so far apart in what they want it’s hilarious. He’d like to camp for a year in various South American countries, possibly teaching, then live in a very rustic cabin in some remote place. She’d like to be in Manhattan. We shall see how that works out!”

    I’m hearing the Green Acres theme song:
    …I’ll take Manhattan
    Give me the countryside…

  95. With all the kids and grandkids visiting L’Abbey, you could probably also run one of those combination day care-nursing home deals. Make some money on the side to support the Totebage Retirement MMM style. I hope I’ll be allowed to visit L’Abbey Totebag retirement home – I’m further from retirement than most of you here. I do maintain an active boating license in RI so if Milo’s out doing the Loop, I can take you all on a field trip… :)

  96. “It’s a little pricey for me, but not out-of-this-world, can-you-imagine outrageous if four couples are splitting it.”

    Yes, one thing I learned after college/before kids was how some very nice accomodations can be affordable when splitting the cost. I stayed in some very nice houses in the Tahoe area this way.

    I also posted this once before; we and a couple other families considered renting it, as the cost was in the same ballpark as many of the hotel options nearby, but we never consummated those plans. I’d still want to consider it if we ever have a few families wanting to take a ski trip together.

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